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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I was trying to explain to a friend why he should C&R the bigger model bass he catches. I was telling him to keep only the smaller model legal ones and release the larger to spawn another day and support the supior gene pool. He commented that the larger fish might not really be a supior gene pool, just older. I had to ponder this and thought I would ask a few of you for help. Any comments?

Thanks
 

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older yes and smarter C&R the bigger ones has been proven in lakes with large mouth bass they can only get bigger if there alive JMO

(fishhawk) jim
 

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Release

Might be best to just let most go.

Based on Personal Experience 32-years ago-

Area- Laguna Beach, CA.

Year- 1974-

Sportfisher: 8.3"-Dinghy "Pursuit" Yes, was in WON many times :)

Results- In just one season of fishing, the mighty sportfisher "Pursuit" oared by bright-eyed 14-yr old teenagers caught and "released" aprox 30-fish between 8 and 12-lbs. I still have all the records. No bull, unless we're taking bass :) Hordes of undersize 3 to 5-pounders kinda robbing s from a strike. I know today's "pros" are fishing hard and promo'n Shimano/magical swim baits/jeans/pliers/rubbers/scents/etc, but they are only getting a fraction of what we had then. Yes, these guys would be hard-pressed to score even a fraction of what we had. Absoletly zero intent to degrade these fine guys, but the fact remains it's kinda sad and true that these bulls are scarce. Meat? Might be best to just drop into the deeper water column and get the rockies. I sure hope those big cali's are kinda hiding are are not just getting smaller. Bull Bass use to mean a fish over 8#. How many of those have you caught and released in the past? JSea?
 

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I have no reason to keep big Bass, Calico or Sand Bass.
One must remember though, to each their own.

John.
Parker 2320 'FloMar'.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
RE: C&R BIg Bass?

Thanks for the replys, but I have yet to hear something I can use as a difinative arguement. If you have a 16" bass does it or does it not have the potential to be a trophy? So I can see his point, which was why should he keep a 16" for dinner and not a 21".
As for the wide open laguna story, we all dream..... my personal opinion is that its not what has been caught and kept that has done the major damage and driven our fishery into the sorry state it is in compared to the past, but the loss of pristine habitat. With billions of gallons of partially treated raw sewage being dumped in the ocean each MONTH along with toxic chemical runoff its a wonder anything still lives.
Overpopulation- over polluted-over fished....etc Of course the only ones that get screwed and blamed are the fishermen, not the city waste facilities or the chemical corporations......sorry guys don't get me started.
So anyway maybe I'll just tell him that the bigger bass have a lot of DDT and PCB's built up as they are older and therefor not healthy table fair. But how would I explain SCI or even Cat.......nuclear testing
 

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Very simple

the bigger ones are stronger and much older than the smaller ones. Therefore, the meat is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay tougher and lacks any semblance of flavor. go for the little ones, their meat is "virgin" tender & tasty.

actually, I liked your "chemical accumulation" better. the tides carry mainland pollution to the outer islands, didn't you know that?

plus, the navy at SCI discharges super-secret stuff in the water. the fish grow bigger because of it; but at what cost to the edible parts?
 

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RE: Very simple

Here some answers:

1. Many of the big calicos are females. Big females lay exponentially more eggs than small females. Therefore, they are crucial to growth of calico bass population. Calicos are slow growing. Therefore the number of large females will come from the 16in. or larger fish released, not killed.

2. Larger fish may have just been lucky, or they may be more adaptive and thus smarter. In any case, genetically larger fish that breed with larger males produce offspring that will grow larger on the average. In Alaska, hatcheries try to to produce super salmon through natural spawning of eggs from huge females and milt from huge males. What I mean by "natural" is no genetic altering like what produces the Alpers frankenfish trout.

3. The larger calicos and sandies are tougher and less tasty, and definitely contain more PCBs, DDT and other petro-chemical pollutants.

4. Calicos and sand bass are rec only fish. If we are to have a trophy bass fishery again, the sole responsibility for that is our hands. Can't blame the commercials for this one, except that the gill nets did major damage to large bass before Prop 132 pushed them 3 miles out. But commercials are no longer a factor. It's on us.

5. Petro-chemical pollution and destruction of kelp and wetlands is playing a major role in diminishing stocks, and perhaps size. Because that is a given and the the petro-chemical industry is pushing and financiallly supporting MPAs as a diversion from its role in destroying the nearshore environment, it is even more important to release the bigger fish.

6. We are sportsmen and women, no? We are not subsistence fishers. So act like one and catch, photograph and release. I do confess to keeping a couple of UNDER 16in. calicos from time to time because they are delicious.

Fish the Tides - Freddie
 

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I have been considering the age and length of time it takes to grow any fish to "record" size.

I understand that a 200 plus pound tuna is only 6 to 9 years old. Dorado grow even faster. This resource replentishes its self rapidly.


Free diving at the Coronado Islands in the late '60's, I speared a black sea bass that weighed in at 360 pounds. I later discovered that fish was probably over 80 years old. (Tasted good though! Not tough at all.) I think a large cow cod may be over 100 years old. I was told that it would take a calico about 15 to 20 years to reach 10 plus pounds. Since it take so long for them to grow to size, I usually release the large rock fish even in Mexico where it is legal to take BSB.

Genetically speaking, there is a difference in the gene that determines size of a fish. Large mouth bass imported to California in the early '60's have proven to reach a larger size than bass in other areas and the current wisdom is that we were lucky when we imported the original stock from Florida and introduced fish with genes that produce larger fish.

So if a calico has reached a respectable size, I think it makes some kind of sense to release it to contribute the genes to the calico society. If you want a trophy, take a picture and have a replica made. Eat the smaller legal ones if you like.

JMHO
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
RE: C&R BIg Bass?

Thank You Freddie and JMHO, I am just going to print your replys, they are excellent!
Now if we could just post this on the charters......I know they make a living doing this, but its the charter customers that I see keeping anything they can. I guess they feel since they are paying to be taken fishing they want to get their money worth. Like its free for us PBers, ha, but most PBers do C&R. I just wish the DFG would lower the keep limits at least in half.
 

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RE: C&;R BIg Bass?

Hi Ringo 7,

Good Grief ...... with all the good reasons why one might want to C & R or CP & R larger members of a fishy species, I had to really stretch things and actually use a little imagination.

1) A goodly number of fish we anlgers come across seem to have no problem chomping on their juvenile counterparts (check out the halibut that coughed up a juvenile recently, pike that eat one another, etc.)! With the bigger fish inhabiting the same areas where smaller fish forage, what more suitable fish to cull its' sick, injured, or weaker members could there be than a fish with the same instincts and habitat.

2) A big ol' fishiy may take over an area forcing smaller fishys to venture out further than they might otherwise ...thus creating 'new' or a widening of the species habitation. Hummm....... this one doesn't sound like total BS.



Livin' the Dream !!

tsurikichi
 

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RE: C&;R BIg Bass?

the real question is why dont they impose a smaller bag limit and a slot limit, say from 10-14 inches and 10 fish bass limit but no more than 5 of them calicos.
that sounds reasonable, and would promote larger healthier bass populations.
 
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