DFG at the dock surveys
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Cooperate with the dock surveys
No Andrew,
This is an improved way to gather data on recreational take. It was the lack of data that allowed the enviros to spew all kinds of exaggerated claims of "no fish left" at the CI. The new gathering method, eyeballing, measuring, etc., and this happens on the party boats too, is something RFA and the party boat association (SAC) lobbied for in Washington. The funds came forth.
Also helping was that a study by the National Academy of Science declared the former way of gathering rec data (random phone calls) unscientific and caused gross false estimates of rec take and fish abundance. Cooperate with them. They are not DFG officers but employees, many of them graduate students. They cannot cite anyone and have no interest in doing so, only gathering data. Data is good. If they have a badge and a gun, they are DFG officers. These data folks are armed with pencils and forms and measuring devices, the stuff of statistics.
Fish the Tides - Freddie
No Andrew,
This is an improved way to gather data on recreational take. It was the lack of data that allowed the enviros to spew all kinds of exaggerated claims of "no fish left" at the CI. The new gathering method, eyeballing, measuring, etc., and this happens on the party boats too, is something RFA and the party boat association (SAC) lobbied for in Washington. The funds came forth.
Also helping was that a study by the National Academy of Science declared the former way of gathering rec data (random phone calls) unscientific and caused gross false estimates of rec take and fish abundance. Cooperate with them. They are not DFG officers but employees, many of them graduate students. They cannot cite anyone and have no interest in doing so, only gathering data. Data is good. If they have a badge and a gun, they are DFG officers. These data folks are armed with pencils and forms and measuring devices, the stuff of statistics.
Fish the Tides - Freddie
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RE: Cooperate with the dock surveys
Yesrs ago I heard to not tell them anything.
I will make sure I help them out in the future.
Thanks for your input.
Dive Deep and Fish Hard!
Roger
[email protected]
http://momentoffame.com
Yesrs ago I heard to not tell them anything.
I will make sure I help them out in the future.
Thanks for your input.
Dive Deep and Fish Hard!
Roger
[email protected]
http://momentoffame.com
RE: Cooperate with the dock surveys
I should add that the results of the first year of the new data gathering method (I'll save you the alphabet soup of its title), in 2005 made it possible for the DFG to extend and add depth to our rockfish season this year, and probably next year. So we are already reaping the benefit of the new data collection system represented by the dock surveyors.
Fish the Tides - Freddie
I should add that the results of the first year of the new data gathering method (I'll save you the alphabet soup of its title), in 2005 made it possible for the DFG to extend and add depth to our rockfish season this year, and probably next year. So we are already reaping the benefit of the new data collection system represented by the dock surveyors.
Fish the Tides - Freddie
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9,049 Posts
RE: Cooperate with the dock surveys
>Yesrs ago I heard to not tell them anything.
I was one of the people who took that position years ago. At that time the "surveys" were being done by DFG "scientific personnel". At that time I had the strong feeling that DFG had a preconceived agenda and the "data" they mined would indeed be used against us, i.e. determine where most of the fish are being caught and make it off limits.
As Freddie pointed out this is a new day and a very different program. While I remain very, very skeptical about how DFG will analyze and use the data, I am persuaded by Freddie and others that cooperation is the better course at this time.
>Yesrs ago I heard to not tell them anything.
I was one of the people who took that position years ago. At that time the "surveys" were being done by DFG "scientific personnel". At that time I had the strong feeling that DFG had a preconceived agenda and the "data" they mined would indeed be used against us, i.e. determine where most of the fish are being caught and make it off limits.
As Freddie pointed out this is a new day and a very different program. While I remain very, very skeptical about how DFG will analyze and use the data, I am persuaded by Freddie and others that cooperation is the better course at this time.
I know several "survey" employees for the DFG, and the best thing we can do is honestly tell them what we see, and catch. The DFG needs good, and reliable, data to contradict the opposition's claims about the fishery. Let's help ourselves, and not hide anything. The truth will be our friend in the end I believe. The DFG looks at "one on one" reports as very accurate data ... it's not going to do us any harm.
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Ferg
Holo-Nui
Monterey 302, Huntington Harbor
Ferg
Holo-Nui
Monterey 302, Huntington Harbor
the dfg is not your friend.....harboring any thoughts along the line of "the spirit of cooperation" is naive...i suggest only answering questions you are legally mandated to.....period
any spew about a better way to get data, data against the enviros, bla bla bla...is just that, spew.....the only way to get legally binding data is with the madatory reporting of ALL recreational catch....punch cards and catch tags
edit.... i may have hurt some feelings with my opinion....i apologise....i know everyone here has the best of intentions
any spew about a better way to get data, data against the enviros, bla bla bla...is just that, spew.....the only way to get legally binding data is with the madatory reporting of ALL recreational catch....punch cards and catch tags
edit.... i may have hurt some feelings with my opinion....i apologise....i know everyone here has the best of intentions
I'll respectively differ, John.
The new data collection system may not be perfect, but it is far, far better than the old one (MRFFS) for recreational take. Already it has established rockfish seasons for two years running that are predicated on new stats that recreational take is well under quota in most cases. That's why last year, unlike prior years, we did not have emergency in-season groundfish closures for recs, and we're very unlikly to this year.
It is also why our take didn't close your season!
Come to a PFMC Groundfish Advisory Subpanel meeting, or attend a meeting of the DFG's Groundfish Taskforce. It's a new regime, and commercials are getting along with recreationals better than ever, thanks to this better data.
Joel
[font size=-2 color=black]DARK SIDE MEMBER[/font]
[font size=-2 color=black]SAVE SPORTFISHING [link:www.joinrfa.org|Join RFA][/font]
The new data collection system may not be perfect, but it is far, far better than the old one (MRFFS) for recreational take. Already it has established rockfish seasons for two years running that are predicated on new stats that recreational take is well under quota in most cases. That's why last year, unlike prior years, we did not have emergency in-season groundfish closures for recs, and we're very unlikly to this year.
It is also why our take didn't close your season!
Come to a PFMC Groundfish Advisory Subpanel meeting, or attend a meeting of the DFG's Groundfish Taskforce. It's a new regime, and commercials are getting along with recreationals better than ever, thanks to this better data.
Joel
[font size=-2 color=black]DARK SIDE MEMBER[/font]
[font size=-2 color=black]SAVE SPORTFISHING [link:www.joinrfa.org|Join RFA][/font]
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RE: Cooperate with the dock surveys
Hi freddie,
Well stated. Good data can't be bad if put in the proper context!
One strange thing .... I don't know if it's because I have a life-time license, fish 150~200 days a year, or don't keep fish but every time I have been surveyed on a boat (get surveyed about once every 2 months or so), as I agree to be called, they call me for further information. I get a phone call every time and spend about 10 minutes on the phone with a DFG person.
Hope it helps in a positive way! Still wonder why I'm so popular!
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Hi freddie,
Well stated. Good data can't be bad if put in the proper context!
One strange thing .... I don't know if it's because I have a life-time license, fish 150~200 days a year, or don't keep fish but every time I have been surveyed on a boat (get surveyed about once every 2 months or so), as I agree to be called, they call me for further information. I get a phone call every time and spend about 10 minutes on the phone with a DFG person.
Hope it helps in a positive way! Still wonder why I'm so popular!
RE: I'll respectively differ, John.
better?....i feel it's just another way to guess how many jellybeans are in the jar....the beans need to be counted BEFORE they go into the jar.....yes, it would be a pain in the a$$... but when the regulators factor in every last pound of commercial catch in the nearshore rockfish fishery, it is absolute insanity to guess at the other 80% of the catch.
better?....i feel it's just another way to guess how many jellybeans are in the jar....the beans need to be counted BEFORE they go into the jar.....yes, it would be a pain in the a$$... but when the regulators factor in every last pound of commercial catch in the nearshore rockfish fishery, it is absolute insanity to guess at the other 80% of the catch.
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>the dfg is not your friend.....harboring any thoughts along
>the line of "the spirit of cooperation" is naive...i suggest
>only answering questions you are legally mandated
>to.....period
>
>
>any spew about a better way to get data, data against the
>enviros, bla bla bla...is just that, spew.....the only way to
>get legally binding data is with the madatory reporting of ALL
>recreational catch....punch cards and catch tags
>
>
>edit.... i may have hurt some feelings with my opinion....i
>apologise....i know everyone here has the best of intentions
John,
Don't go soft now, tell it like it is, it's one of the things I like about you!
ps: I have three T shirts, my other two connection are lagging, do you want me to mail up the three now or wait for all of them?
>the line of "the spirit of cooperation" is naive...i suggest
>only answering questions you are legally mandated
>to.....period
>
>
>any spew about a better way to get data, data against the
>enviros, bla bla bla...is just that, spew.....the only way to
>get legally binding data is with the madatory reporting of ALL
>recreational catch....punch cards and catch tags
>
>
>edit.... i may have hurt some feelings with my opinion....i
>apologise....i know everyone here has the best of intentions
John,
Don't go soft now, tell it like it is, it's one of the things I like about you!
ps: I have three T shirts, my other two connection are lagging, do you want me to mail up the three now or wait for all of them?
Joined
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4,515 Posts
Sounds good John!
RE: Cooperate with the dock surveys
Freddie you are absolutly correct and I coulod not of explained it any better myself. They are on the side of the rec fisherman. Dont hesitate to give them any info even if you catch and release, tell them type, size amount and area fished it is for our good.
Freddie you are absolutly correct and I coulod not of explained it any better myself. They are on the side of the rec fisherman. Dont hesitate to give them any info even if you catch and release, tell them type, size amount and area fished it is for our good.
Taurus, I'm going going to call you misinformed on this subject. It is used to assist in fish limits, seasons opened and closed and the duration of these seasons. Also it will assist in size limits as to age for procreating of the same species. It sounds as if you had a bad experience with F&G. But all I have to say is have a valid licence and dont got over limit and they wont do a thing to you. I gleefully call them over to inspect my license and catch when ever they are in the area. TRY IT.
i speak from 20+ years as a commercial fisherman dealing with dfg regulations...i know how the dfg system works inside and out...try walking in my shoes for 20 years and then have the balls to call me out.
we can only learn and guard ourselves against what we have seen and experienced in the past...any data collected by the dfg has been used against our fishing rights...i think expecting anything else is naive.....show me a truthfull accounting of catch, and i'd be behind it 100%...untill then, fluck'em, they have nothing comming
we can only learn and guard ourselves against what we have seen and experienced in the past...any data collected by the dfg has been used against our fishing rights...i think expecting anything else is naive.....show me a truthfull accounting of catch, and i'd be behind it 100%...untill then, fluck'em, they have nothing comming
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121 Posts
I have had several long converesations with the people who count the fish. They are the first ones to provide an accurate picture of the recreational take. We were getting hosed before when the "scientists" were telling everyone that we were taking as much or more than the commercial guys.
As mentioned by other posters, these people are helping us. As an example, they are reporting that the population of boccacio is more than healthy. They ride the sport boats and see exactly what is going on. Their reports will be an asset to us in the long run.
As mentioned by other posters, these people are helping us. As an example, they are reporting that the population of boccacio is more than healthy. They ride the sport boats and see exactly what is going on. Their reports will be an asset to us in the long run.
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